Comments on: Back to the NSA Database Issue

By: Pros and Cons » Yet more on the Intel debate

Pros and Cons » Yet more on the Intel debate — Tue, 16 May 2024 18:39:45 +0000

[...] twice. That’s countered by Bryan S. at Arguing with Signposts who channeled our own Dr. Steven Taylor. Well, he may be ours, but he’s wrong. Either this is for criminal prosecution or it i [...]

By: voice

voice — Sun, 14 May 2024 23:22:59 +0000

The program is unquestionably intrusive. 2 questions rise to the top.

1. What is the benefit? I’m going to go out on a limb here. To me, the silence of the administration about results is proof positive of nothing to show. I find it hard to believe that the PR machine that twisted the ordeals of Lyndie Engalnd and Pat Tillman into heroic tales of the war on terror could resist even the whiff of something to show the taxpayer/voter a return on ONE TRILLION DOLLARS.

2. Who will have access? On some level the US goverment is creating the most valuable database ever. Phone records, travel, reading habits and financial tansactions are being collected by the government. Any catoegory of this data is extraordinarily valuable to folks who pay the campaign bills. Linked, this data could become the new Fort Knox backing US currency. The Amercian consumer is every marketer’s blue ribbon prize.

The mutual back scratching between Republicans and Big Business forces one to ask: why did Verizon et al comply? Was it an emotional/political responce to 9/11 or a unique opprotunity to aggregate and access business-critical data? Given that these companies understood the financial risk they were taking (possibility of $1000 fine per subscriber), what was the upside?

Do these databases have value in the war on terror? Who knows?
Do they have value to political contributors? Unquestionably.

By: The Liberal Avenger » Blog Archive » How big is YOUR file?

The Liberal Avenger » Blog Archive » How big is YOUR file? — Sat, 13 May 2024 18:20:55 +0000

[...] ess Cake

How big is YOUR file?
May 13th, 2024 by LA

PoliBlog: A Rough Draft of my Thoughts – Back to the NSA Database Issue sgo sent me to this conservative blog [...]

By: Brook

Brook — Sat, 13 May 2024 16:06:40 +0000

My 7yo sighed when he first heard Bush talking about the wireless tapping and, in some ways justifying it because he, the president, is a good person concerned with the wellbeing of all Americans. “Mom, doesn’t he understand that it’s not about him? There have to be checks and balances because what about the next guy? What if he isn’t a good guy? I think it’s especially important that our president really pay attention to the laws and the constitution because if he doesn’t why should the rest of us?”

By: Ray

Ray — Sat, 13 May 2024 09:20:20 +0000

Everyone forgets the 50′s – when the government was spying on the people to stop communism – the threat at the time – was kept secret. 50 years after the fact everyone forgot the abuses that were carried out by the individuals who controlled the spying – McCarthy and Hoover ( who had many personal issues and was paranoid ) – they controlled the information and therefore people. Seems odd that history like this get forgotten and not even mentioned – in a few weeks no one will remember this happened, because a new tape from OBL will surface and all the news will be re-directed away from the real issues. Yes, I believe the government has been monitoring phone calls, keeping records of where everyone travels to, monitors and keeps records of all cel phone calls, keeps records of who visits what websites, where you buy your gas from, how much alcohol you drink and what kind of guns you own, etc. etc. etc.. These stories came out 3 years ago and everyone forgot them then because focus was purposely shifted away from the “REAL” issues as they will again. These abuses of the LAW where known about 3 years ago but no one really spoke about them – I know I didn’t for fear of being called “UnPatriotic”. Wait till Jeb is President! There is no such thing as privacy anymore and it is not a guaranteed right in the United States – just look at all the cameras on the street corners and watch the movie with Will Smith and Gene Hackman – ‘Enemy of the State’ a movie before its time – a movie of what is happening today! Do not fear – these lists are monitored too – for all the commies – ooh – sorry – terrorists out there. Forget what century I’m in! Finally, It is a shame the United States is becomint what it has so long fought against – A country trying to control its people through FEAR!

By: Pamela

Pamela — Sat, 13 May 2024 08:55:24 +0000

The Bush family, not unlike that of the Kennedy’s and many other familial units, obtains its “tactics” and learned behaviors from the smartest criminal enterprises in the world. Anyone on the outside looking in is logically pessimistic and suspicious of what is initiated and produced from such environments.

The phone records being collected are thus under logical suspicion and any reasonable mind would infer that the data is being used for some criminal endeavor that is directly related to power and control. Intelligent minds can only deduce that there are two realms involved – politics combined with greed, and that the data will be used and abused for these purposes.

By: Rubicon

Rubicon — Sat, 13 May 2024 06:02:50 +0000

I’m not a lawyer, but I don’t see how this could not violate the law:

The contractually stated privacy of business communications.

The total disregard for “probable cause”.

the gross violation of constitutional rights by a simple (and I do mean simple) majority in panic

are all these swept away by a complete failure of the same executive branch to protect us from terrorist attacks using the same untenable unproductive tactics they propose now?

By: Evert Fowle

Evert Fowle — Sat, 13 May 2024 02:01:23 +0000

The road to dictatorship is paved with declarations that each successive intrusion into our liberty and privacy is necessary to fight Al Queada. Al Queada could not have possibly dreamed of the damage they could cause to the fabric of our nation. The same President who assures us that he is only compiling data on the actual phone call also acknowledges no limitation on his own power. If he determines that his action is in furtherance of the National Security it is legal. Each revelation as to how far our government has gone in its intrusion into our privacy is disheartening. The war on terror is certainly worth fighting, as our way of life deserves to be protected. Our civil liberties are worth defending as well. I am still waiting for a leader to emerge who views the assault on liberty from within as grave a threat as any of our foreign enemies.

By: Puddle Jumper

Puddle Jumper — Sat, 13 May 2024 01:48:54 +0000

Many of the people working in the Bush admistration are undeniable unethical law breaking scum. I have not a doubt that real intention of collecting this data was not to troll for terroists but to be able to spy on they’re own cronies. Amount thiefs there is no honor.

By: Sarge

Sarge — Fri, 12 May 2024 23:51:48 +0000

These activities are anti-American.

They are the opposite of patriotic, because they do not defend the rights of Americans.

Bush has shown himself to be traitorous to America. He is anti-American.

The telco executives participating in his are traitors. They are anti-American.

The NSA creeps putting programs like this together are traitors to their country. They are anti-American.

I think all things like this should be called what it is – anti-American activities.

The Presidential Oath of Office
I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of
President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability,
PRESERVE, PROTECT, AND DEFEND THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES.

U.S. Constitution: Fourth Amendment
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

If YOU do not understand that, then YOU are anti-American.

Period.