You forgot to mention the 2 million or so refugees of Bush’s War who are currently in camps in Syria and Jordan and the over 1 million Iraqis who are internally displaced.
Comment by Ratoe — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:47 pm
It is in the last paragraph quoted from the BBC–and they cite 2 million internal and 2 million abroad.
Comment by Dr. Steven Taylor — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:56 pm
Sorry! I can’t read numbers when they are spelled out!
Comment by Ratoe — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:58 pm
It is rather easy to overlook things (at least it is for me).
Comment by Dr. Steven Taylor — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 1:32 pm
You are far more cogent here than in our e-mails. I am, accordingly, linking again.
Very well said.
That said, our post-war situation (1780s) was disastrous, as far as the funcitoning of the central government, and Oxfam listed the folks of Baquba, generally a pudgy lot, as lacking adequte food supplies. Never underestimate the potency of a generatioons old black market.
I find it hard to believe that with the Southern Marshes drained and Kurdistan in constant war with the towns depopulated and 1/3 of the country as internal or international refugees during the Baath, that only 20% of Iraq lacked access to adequate water supplies.
Instead I point to the difficultiues of gathering good information in totalitarian societies versus relatively easy access (and an incentive to over-report suffering in order to get relief – not that I find much wrong with that, if Germans are willing to pay, let ‘em pay) now.
[...] UPDATE II: More Dr. Taylor, making his point far clearly than in the above link, can be read here. His gloomy analysis is well worth the read. My response is in the comments, in case anyone cares. So are those of people talking of teeh suffering caused by ”Bush’s war” (which was, naturally, different from the greater suffering it replaced) and which, from the vehemence of thier spleen, I suspect they supported back in the day. Dr. Talyor also links to a NYT article cal;led “A War We Can Win”. [...]
Il mondo è tornato ad essere un posto normale. Ricordate, qualche settimana fa, l’editoriale del New York Times (la password per leggerlo cercatela qui) che invocava il ritiro statunitense dall’Iraq? Il giorno dopo, giornali e telegiornali italiani a…
It’s only fair to ask if some of the refugees who have fled to other countries might not have done so prior to the war (simply to escape the vices of the Hussein regime and the Baath party) if they had the ability.
While I am not a booster of the “surge”, per se, I am a supporter of General Petraeus. I served under him and know him to be a brilliant man. He’s doing the best he can with a bad situation.
For those who wish to call it “Bush’s war”, it’s only fair to remember that Congress did in fact authorize the war. If we want to throw blame there is plenty to pass around, and while the president may get a triple helping, there are plenty of others who have earned a share.
Comment by Captain D. — Tuesday, July 31, 2024 @ 12:18 pm
[...] He also reports on some of the problems Professor Taylor (non-insanely) worries about so: Because the one thing that definitely can run us out of here is the civil war, it follows that disrupting al Qaeda is like taking the blowtorch off the curtains. And for the beleaguered people of Baqubah, something nearly every family could see instantly as a positive sign would be the renewal of regular food distribution. There are many other shortages and problems for military and civilian leaders to sort through, but a food shortage is something that could be immediately ameliorated. Iraq is a breadbasket: there’s plenty of food here, it only takes trucks to move it around. [...]
[...] administration has never had, it is impossible to make appropriate policy choices going forward. Sphere: Related Content Filed under: Iraq || [...]
You forgot to mention the 2 million or so refugees of Bush’s War who are currently in camps in Syria and Jordan and the over 1 million Iraqis who are internally displaced.
Comment by Ratoe — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:47 pm
It is in the last paragraph quoted from the BBC–and they cite 2 million internal and 2 million abroad.
Comment by Dr. Steven Taylor — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:56 pm
Sorry! I can’t read numbers when they are spelled out!
Comment by Ratoe — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 12:58 pm
It is rather easy to overlook things (at least it is for me).
Comment by Dr. Steven Taylor — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 1:32 pm
You are far more cogent here than in our e-mails. I am, accordingly, linking again.
Very well said.
That said, our post-war situation (1780s) was disastrous, as far as the funcitoning of the central government, and Oxfam listed the folks of Baquba, generally a pudgy lot, as lacking adequte food supplies. Never underestimate the potency of a generatioons old black market.
I find it hard to believe that with the Southern Marshes drained and Kurdistan in constant war with the towns depopulated and 1/3 of the country as internal or international refugees during the Baath, that only 20% of Iraq lacked access to adequate water supplies.
Instead I point to the difficultiues of gathering good information in totalitarian societies versus relatively easy access (and an incentive to over-report suffering in order to get relief – not that I find much wrong with that, if Germans are willing to pay, let ‘em pay) now.
Comment by Honza P — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 5:02 pm
[...] UPDATE II: More Dr. Taylor, making his point far clearly than in the above link, can be read here. His gloomy analysis is well worth the read. My response is in the comments, in case anyone cares. So are those of people talking of teeh suffering caused by ”Bush’s war” (which was, naturally, different from the greater suffering it replaced) and which, from the vehemence of thier spleen, I suspect they supported back in the day. Dr. Talyor also links to a NYT article cal;led “A War We Can Win”. [...]
Pingback by Pros and Cons » GWOT Update, Updated, Twice — Monday, July 30, 2024 @ 5:10 pm
Mission Accomplished
Il mondo è tornato ad essere un posto normale. Ricordate, qualche settimana fa, l’editoriale del New York Times (la password per leggerlo cercatela qui) che invocava il ritiro statunitense dall’Iraq? Il giorno dopo, giornali e telegiornali italiani a…
Trackback by The Right Nation — Tuesday, July 31, 2024 @ 9:22 am
It’s only fair to ask if some of the refugees who have fled to other countries might not have done so prior to the war (simply to escape the vices of the Hussein regime and the Baath party) if they had the ability.
While I am not a booster of the “surge”, per se, I am a supporter of General Petraeus. I served under him and know him to be a brilliant man. He’s doing the best he can with a bad situation.
For those who wish to call it “Bush’s war”, it’s only fair to remember that Congress did in fact authorize the war. If we want to throw blame there is plenty to pass around, and while the president may get a triple helping, there are plenty of others who have earned a share.
Comment by Captain D. — Tuesday, July 31, 2024 @ 12:18 pm
[...] He also reports on some of the problems Professor Taylor (non-insanely) worries about so: Because the one thing that definitely can run us out of here is the civil war, it follows that disrupting al Qaeda is like taking the blowtorch off the curtains. And for the beleaguered people of Baqubah, something nearly every family could see instantly as a positive sign would be the renewal of regular food distribution. There are many other shortages and problems for military and civilian leaders to sort through, but a food shortage is something that could be immediately ameliorated. Iraq is a breadbasket: there’s plenty of food here, it only takes trucks to move it around. [...]
Pingback by Pros and Cons » The latest from Iraq, with some reportage from Afghanistan/Pakistan — Tuesday, July 31, 2024 @ 7:02 pm
[...] administration has never had, it is impossible to make appropriate policy choices going forward. Sphere: Related Content Filed under: Iraq || [...]
Pingback by PoliBlog ™: A Rough Draft of my Thoughts » Trouble in Basra — Tuesday, August 7, 2024 @ 4:21 pm