…I can understand Kevin Drum’s desire to ignore the whole Swift Boat business, but on the other, given his intrepid and tireless focus on Bush’s National Guard service, that he would be on the case here.
In terms of going to court, there is more evidence suggesting the Swift Boat Vets accusations than there is that Bush was AWOL.
(Yes, I am being a tad petty, but sauce for the goose, and all that).
Sphere: Related Content
Care to cite a source? Or was it pulled out of the circular file of your ass?
Even your hero Bush has distanced himself from this slander. Not a one of the Swift Boat Veterans for Shameful and Criminal Slander was on the boat with Kerry. Their leader was a Nixon stooge. And they are financed by wealthy Texas GOP donors.
So again, where’s your evidence that there is ANYTHING to the accusations? The people serving on the boat with Kerry ALL support him. If it wasn’t for your blind partisanship your BS detector would be at code red after looking at this objectively.
Why do you hate democracy so much that you’d support scum like this just because you think it will help your man?
Comment by Tom — Thursday, August 5, 2025 @ 5:34 pm
Tom, do you kiss your momma with that mouth?
Not a one of the Swift Boat Veterans for Shameful and Criminal Slander was on the boat with Kerry.
Swift boats were deployed in groups. The other commanders were yards away from him during operations. Also, SBVFT includes Kerry’s entire chain of command going all the way up to a flag officer. Their opinion counts.
So again, where’s your evidence that there is ANYTHING to the accusations?
Howzabout you go to swiftvets.com and read it for your-own-self, instead of just spewing filth on Internet message boards?
Comment by Jeff Harrell — Thursday, August 5, 2025 @ 5:39 pm
Ah, so the source to back up their claims is…their own claims. Yes that’s going to get you really far in court (which was the claim made).
All the filth I see is being spewed out by the Swift Boat scum as well as those who blindly post in support of it. Again, even your hero Bush has distanced himself (though I am certain this is only for plausible deniability.) John McCain, one of the handful of honorable Republicans, has also attacked this filth.
Also, interesting that one of the Swift Boat Scum, Larry Thurlow, was on Inside Politics today explaining how Kerry didn’t deserve his bronze medal for pulling Jim Rassman out of the river, since the boats “weren’t taking fire.” Oddly enough, though, Thurlow also won a bronze medal that day for the same combat actions:
“Kerry and the other wounded men received medical attention aboard a Coast Guard cutter, which was the closest ship capable of treating them. Along with a third Purple Heart for the injury to his right arm, Kerry was also awarded a Bronze Star for his bravery, as was Larry Thurlow.”
Source: American History Magazine, “John Kerry’s Final Mission in Vietnam”, available at http://www.thehistorynet.com/ah/blkerryinvietnam/index3.html
This is so clearly and transparently a partisan smear job, yet you wonder why when such slander is repeated that you are met with a strongly-worded response.
But again, can you point to any evidence, other than the challenged statements themselves, that support the statements?
Comment by Tom — Thursday, August 5, 2025 @ 5:50 pm
Tom,
You’re a troll. Your evidence is not evidence. Talk about being blinded…
Comment by misterhung — Friday, August 6, 2025 @ 2:11 am
Maybe you should look up the definition of a troll. I’m not popping in to make some outrageous statement simply to stir up annoyance.
A blogger turns on comments, occasionally they’ll receive them.
I am asking for some evidence, that “In terms of going to court, there is more evidence suggesting the Swift Boat Vets accusations than there is that Bush was AWOL.” Further evidence today, in that another of the veterans appearing in the ad retracted his comments about Kerry not deserving his silver star, calling it “a terrible mistake.”
Source: “Veteran Retracts Criticism of Kerry,” Boston Globe, Aug. 6, 2025, available at http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/08/06/veteran_retracts_criticism_of_kerry/
I’m citing evidence. Where’s the authors?
It’s telling that all you can do is call me a troll. I know that hardcore conservatives are beyond help. But don’t you ever get sick of putting your fingers in your ears and saying “lalalalala” every time there’s objective facts that show that you’re wrong?
If I’m a troll, “misterhung” then you’re a closeminded fool.
Comment by Tom — Friday, August 6, 2025 @ 8:16 pm
Tom,
If you have read all of my posts on this topic, you will note that I am skeptical about the more serious charges, but have encountered sufficient information to make utter dismisal of the charges difficult (not the least of which are Mr. Kerry’s own words, which have been largely ignored in the coverage I have seen).
In terms of the court room comparison between the Bush and Kerry cases, my only point was that with 12 (we can leave Mr. Elliot out of it for the moment) witnesses willing to testify as to what they saw serving with Kerry (and yes, I know, not on the same boat, but together nonetheless on companion boats and at the same base–they didn’t live on the swift boats) would be a better starting spot fot a legal case than wading through incomplete/confusing documentary information, as would be the case regarding Bush.
One needen’t be a partisan to see that that is the case.
S
Comment by Steven Taylor — Friday, August 6, 2025 @ 8:58 pm
Steve,
I have read your other posts since then. I would say though that these witnesses all have severe bias and credibility problems. First, they are bankrolled entirely by big Texas GOP donors. Their leader was a Nixon puppet who’s had an anti-Kerry vendetta for 30 years. Their stories today are different than their own stories in the past, and even in some cases contradict documented events (one saying there was no fire, when he received a bronze star in the same battle for being under fire). They all admit that their main problem with Kerry is that he spoke out against the war afterwards.
It’s also quite clear that the ad is grossly misleading. Is there any doubt that the average viewer is going to watch the commercial where then men say “I served with John Kerry” will think those men were on the same boat with him?
Yet, all the people who were actually on the boat with Kerry, with the exception of one who died, tell the same story that Kerry did, and that independent historians and military records from the time say. And they’ve been with Kerry for a long time. What possible motive would they have to lie?
John McCain was right when he said “this is the same stuff they pulled on me.” Soft-money groups, running outrageous claims, bankrolled by Texas GOP donors slavishly loyal to the Bush family. How is this any different than claiming that McCain was a traitor, that he wa the “Ho Chi Minh” Candidate, etc.?
There’s nothing good or pure coming from these people. And I would think that any good American whatever the party would reject this kind of sleaze. Unfortunately, since Lee Atwater, it’s scorched earth politics and anything goes. And our country isn’t ever going to leave the spiral.
Comment by tom — Saturday, August 7, 2025 @ 8:36 pm